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General Discussion & Suggestions
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Topic Subject: Stranger's Dwigg Mod
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posted 03-30-05 02:59 AM EDT (US)   
Dwiggs5.0 is available here:

Update 17-12-19 Joep and I are making an Age of Wonders 3 Dwiggs mod. If anyone is interested, just email me at


In regards to Dwiggs mod, special thanks to:

El Joep-who did too much to list.

Timelord-again, too much to list.

Igoraki-converted many of the new graphics.

Merkraad-taught me the whole morphing thing

Kirky Picardo-maker of the excellent Brave New World mod. Like Timelord and Joep, he helped me too much to list just any one thing.

Kaskoid-Many of the excellent descriptions come from his desk.

Stillborn, Jean Luc, and many others also contributed some very creative descriptions. Look for the letter at the end of the description to see who wrote it.

If you wish to contact me, you can do so at

[This message has been edited by The_Stranger (edited 12-16-2019 @ 08:19 PM).]

posted 01-28-06 11:51 PM EDT (US)     571 / 2994  

Another version? Not asking too much, eh? Good lord, we still have a ton of beta testing yet to come...

Surely if someone wanted to, they could put together a package of heros that could be downloaded like an Expansion Pack.

Making the most use of the heros available is part of playing the game well; new heros are just window dressing- the gameplay's the thing...

Arch-Enemy of the Annoyingly Dense
Practitioner of Whimsy
Celt,Finn & Swede Elder Gamer
posted 01-29-06 08:52 PM EDT (US)     572 / 2994  
Thanks Swolte, Stranger I tried listening to your suggestions, although I didn't know what 'CGI-ish' means. I hope these are less. I gave the treehouse a bit more green flavour, decreased the roof size with about 15% and made a new kinda house with your suggestion. Here are the results:
posted 01-29-06 09:37 PM EDT (US)     573 / 2994  

I say remove the white houses from the first pick

The second is good

posted 01-30-06 10:56 AM EDT (US)     574 / 2994  

Don't necessarily remove them.
I think you could "clump" them together by type or nationality.
There is enough historical evidence of this in many cultures where permanent settlements or enclaves of non-indigenous people built what was familiar to them to live in and comprise their settlement. (While I certainly do not believe in being a slave to history, it certainly does provide us with guidelines...)
I am not referring to the classical definition of a ghetto, but rather the cultural mix as evidenced by ruins and traces unearthed at sites of trading towns where cultures mixed freely.
In a TC map, you could easily justify buildings of four or more cultures by putting them on different sides of the city or tower/stronghold/fort. You could get more than 4 by mixing buildings of cultures likely to tolerate each other, or reflect alliances, etc.
Just a thought from someone that has always felt that the TC maps are one of the weakest points of AoW, all iterations.

New Topic/Question along this line:

Is there any means of designating which TC map will be used for a particular city? If so, capitals would not necessarily be mixed architecture, but other cities, based on the storyline, could be of mixed construction.
I would like to see TC maps with lots of different buildings and terrain features that could pose new tactical problems for the attacker.

What are the limitations here?

Another thing that Dwiggs should address if it doesn't already---
How can units heal burn damage while in a burning hex? It chaps my cheeks that I can Wildfire a stack of elephants in a tower (Baff. Inten.), get minimal effects (lousy karma), and then watch them heal up the next turn while still in a burning tower. Doesn't this strike anyone else as odd? Does/can Dwiggs address this? I would really like to see them continue to take minimal damage every turn they remain in a burning hex. I would be happy if you couldn't heal while in a burning hex. Could you Mod the code to treat units in flaming hexes as though they are Cursed?

Arch-Enemy of the Annoyingly Dense
Practitioner of Whimsy
Celt,Finn & Swede Elder Gamer

[This message has been edited by kaskoid (edited 01-30-2006 @ 06:53 PM).]

posted 01-30-06 08:12 PM EDT (US)     575 / 2994  
I, for one, think that the overland map spells could use some improvement. The reason you mentioned is one of these. I don't have a huge amount of experience with overland spells though.
posted 01-30-06 10:06 PM EDT (US)     576 / 2994  
What are people's thoughts on the mastery spells? I personally would like to see them removed.
posted 01-30-06 11:19 PM EDT (US)     577 / 2994  
Mastery spells are just way too powerful; converting every single node? Way too much. There are maps that have nodes that are virtually unreachable that will then never be reclaimed unless someone else throws a Mastery.

I would have no problem with upping the mana for all of a players nodes, those of his magical bent.

I could even live with converting those nodes within the player's borders.

Disjunction would now have different uses, like removing road enchantments or haste spells or even the doom and gloom spells that effect everyone in a player's realm.

Arch-Enemy of the Annoyingly Dense
Practitioner of Whimsy
Celt,Finn & Swede Elder Gamer
posted 01-31-06 05:40 AM EDT (US)     578 / 2994  
well, also you usually have to spend more mana to disjunct a mastery spell than it's caster paid to put it in place! It's ridiculous. I would say the safe bet is to just take them out, though it would be nice if we could somehow change what it did.

EDIT: Also, how hard would it be to make two sets of resources appear for choice in the setup, one with and one without terrain changing spells? Those really hurt PBEM play and actually make it so no one can have any crops while using them.

[This message has been edited by MitchK1989 (edited 01-31-2006 @ 05:42 AM).]

posted 01-31-06 10:20 PM EDT (US)     579 / 2994  
Hey guys,

I've been working on updating the excel/readme files, which are nearing completion.

In regards to some of the topics posted here:

1. The burning/healing question. I don't think it's possible to prevent healing here, without actually switching cursed with burning. However, I will look into it and see what I can do. If the burning units are in a city with a sanctuary, they will heal regardless, of course.

2. Mastery spells. I don't like them much either, and wouldn't mind removing them. They are, though, a decent way to end a long game and/or make the AI more competitive on big maps. I'll have to think a bit more about this, but my inclination is to remove them if that seems to be the desire of the majority of players. It's a pity that we can't alter the mastery spells but they are hardcoded as far as I know.

3. Mitch, which terrain changing spells did you have in mind? It would be pretty easy, actually. You could do it yourself if you wanted



posted 01-31-06 11:32 PM EDT (US)     580 / 2994  
what an evil plans appearing here, dont touch mastery spells, villains
posted 02-01-06 11:52 AM EDT (US)     581 / 2994  
Wetlands, Darklands, Rejuvanate, and Ice Age were the ones I would suggest having removable. They're the ones that screw up crops. I have no problem with clear terrain, raise/lower terrain, or any other one use spell.
posted 02-01-06 12:15 PM EDT (US)     582 / 2994  
I like the mastery spells overall. I mean, it stinks when you get one cast against you, but if you've let the other person save up enough mana to research and cast that spell without attacking him, well, it's sort of your fault. It makes more ways to win the game, which I think is good.

Now, the one problem I have is that in a few games I have played the mastery spells have been available from day 1. That seems bad to me. I much preferred how AoW 1 did spell research - you had to have I think at least 2 spells of a level before it would open up any spells of the next level for a given sphere - its been a while, but a system like that would prevent this problem. But I guess we can't change that.

posted 02-01-06 02:23 PM EDT (US)     583 / 2994  
Maybe we should raise the mana cost of the mastery spells to about 3000 and the upkeep to 100?
posted 02-01-06 06:33 PM EDT (US)     584 / 2994  
I agree in principle with MitchK--make those buggers (Mastery) as expensive as possible, so that only really advanced, or totally undisturbed, wizards can cast them.

Upkeep is a different kettle of fish, depending on the individual map. 100 upkeep might be more than the net gain on a Small map that is node-poor, but not enough on an XL map loaded with nodes and other mana producing structures.

Increase the cost to cast a bunch and increase the upkeep; even a higher upkeep might be worth it for the control that it gives you around the converted nodes.

Wetlands, Darklands, Ice Age and Rejuvenate can stay, IMO, because what better way to screw somebody up than by blighting their crops? If the hardcode bugs still exist that effect this, then get rid of the spells and eliminate the bug.

Arch-Enemy of the Annoyingly Dense
Practitioner of Whimsy
Celt,Finn & Swede Elder Gamer
posted 02-01-06 08:34 PM EDT (US)     585 / 2994  
lol 3000, 34 turns to cast with highest possible rate, no comments :P though price of mastery must be more than 500 i agree, but it must be higher like on 1/3 as most expensive summons cost in dwiggs 400 instead of normal 300 if i remember correct so price of 666 would be good for mastery
posted 02-02-06 00:58 AM EDT (US)     586 / 2994  
if you raise the price of mastery it will be even harder to dispel than before, only realistic way is then killing the wizard.

for high spell cost of mastery everyone can easily use 1 or more catalysts.

if you don't like this spell its better to remove it from all spheres.

Honored Core Balance Team Member of UPatch 1.4
Also known as TirAsleen

[This message has been edited by DarkMystery (edited 02-02-2006 @ 00:58 AM).]

posted 02-02-06 01:54 AM EDT (US)     587 / 2994  
this "everyone" who will cast mastery with use of catalysts will be banned from players community very fast i guess . and dispelling any mastery except air is nonsense (but better dispell haste domain and kill wiz :P), destroying nearest nodes is much simple and reliable way.
posted 02-02-06 02:04 AM EDT (US)     588 / 2994  
3000 cost for a Mastery spell is ridiculous! Better ban it!

The ideal solution would be to increase the cost a little - say, to 666 as Warlord suggested...a sense of evil being done.
That said, I have never seen a Mastery spell cast in any of the Dwiggs games I have played.

2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
posted 02-02-06 03:44 AM EDT (US)     589 / 2994  
May be it's good to switch Mastery spells to Secret Sphere? Thus they will come like surprise. Or, yes, they waste the slot of other may be more useful spell. (if you are going to balance spheres to 5/5/5/5 standart).
Also, as you made lot's of new units you should use summoning spels Dire Penguin, Magic Servant, Chaos Spawn, Chaos Lord, Gold Dragon, Blach Dragon (total 6 - very convenient as 1 additional spell for each sphere) as templates to create different summoning spells for your new units. It's possible to rename spells and spell icons. It would also be nice if you make 2 and 3 level summons for Death and Life speres.

[This message has been edited by Webusver (edited 02-02-2006 @ 04:14 AM).]

posted 02-02-06 05:48 AM EDT (US)     590 / 2994  
Stranger! Please reply to my email regarding the abilities before tomorrow evening your time! I won't be able to check my mail for 2 days after be warned.
This is just a reminder (as I am sure you check this thread every day!)

Also, I like Webusver's idea of adding more summoning spells - if its possible. I certainly vote to remove Black/Gold Dragon and add them to fill the empty summons slots for Life and Death.

2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
posted 02-02-06 01:28 PM EDT (US)     591 / 2994  
Hello everyone,

let's start with latest posts first:

Time, I just sent the message. I'll comment more on your work below, as I think many people will be interested.

On the summoning spells. I've already replaced the Dire Penguin and Magic Servant spells with a Life and Death summons. You'll get to see what they are shortly, but I think Mitch will very much like one of 'em . I've also added a single high level summons as a reward for each spirit. The two dragons have been kept for this purpose, but two more units have been added. They were original units from AoW:SM that needed a home after the new races were added...for Nature and Magic spirits, respectively.

On Mastery and terrain changing spells. A PBEM patch could easily be released after the mod comes out. I would need specific feedback from PBEM players, or one of them could do the necessary tinkering. But for the purposes of single and multiplayer, I really like having most of the terrain changers. And, with the new races, especially the Lizards, a spell like Wetlands is going to be much more useful. Build a war shrine, get units with water concealment, cast wetlands, and let the fun begin In regards to Mastery, I'm a bit more torn. I like the idea of having 5 spells for each level for each sphere. Removing Mastery could accomplish that. However, I also like a bit of randomness in the spell book. Also, I think making Master a touch more expensive to cast as per someone's (was it Air?) idea might do the trick. I'll have to think more about this, as both sides are making good points. Unfortunately, as Zyl suggests, we can't make any prerequistes for researching these spells.

For the potential writers here: as the beta approaches, a batch of new heroes will require their deeds and histories to be published to the credulous world! Hence, I'll be posting 'em above on monday or so.

On Timelord's work: some things you will probably see in the new version: A leperchaun hurling magic bolts that confuse and amaze his foes; an abomination with really sticky spit; a Yeti that can cause an opposing army to truly chill out; upgrades to many abilities at silver and gold levels (trap, entangle, control animal, turn undead, seduce, dominate, strangle), some Dwarvish fire that makes enemies very hot under the collar, flaming arrows (not those posted by certain flamers on the forum ), and perhaps some other surprises. All this will be documented, which, by the way, I am working on finishing.

Best regards,


posted 02-02-06 05:37 PM EDT (US)     592 / 2994  
btw much more better idea to get 5 spells per level is remove to cosmos most uninteresting spells than remove mastery which is always interesting to cast
posted 02-02-06 08:07 PM EDT (US)     593 / 2994  
removing cosmos doesn't do anything, we need 5 spells per level per sphere, and mastery spells aren't interesting, just stupid.
posted 02-02-06 08:29 PM EDT (US)     594 / 2994  
not sure if there is anything to discuss if u not understanding that if for example we move 6th lev1 life spell to cosmos there will be 5 lev1 life spells
posted 02-03-06 04:40 AM EDT (US)     595 / 2994  
For having some randomness, you may choose any level of cosmos sphere and fill it with ALL unnecessary spells. So this level of cosmos will give complete randomness, while other levels will give ensured spells.
BTW it's necessary to give cosmos 3-4 level summons to encourage people to play as non-specialists in magic. In other case they have a great chance of having NO strong summoning spell.
posted 02-03-06 10:51 AM EDT (US)     596 / 2994  
surprising to see so much passion about these spells. I'm not sure if I've ever seen one cast in a MP game, except in super large teams vs. teams or weird conditions. they do unbalance if gotten too early i suppose, but the cost of getting one off.... you shouldnt ever let another player do this. if one guy can sit back and use so much time and magic i think it says you're not being aggressive enough..

but it would be nice if there is any way to make the mastery spells less possible (perhaps putting them as 4th level cosmos has been suggested - it sounds odd, but if it worked...)
i'd be up for the 666 price raiase

posted 02-03-06 11:29 AM EDT (US)     597 / 2994  
strength of cosmos wizards are different enchantments and combining medium lev spells from different spheres, while sphere spec strength are lev4 summons and mastery, if cosmos will get strong summons and mastery will be removed why take sphere spec? for example with 3 earth 3 air i can get earth awareness, haste, stone skin, tornado, wind ward, seeker, earth and air elementals and what additional useful spells i will get as spec for losing half of useful ones i mentioned?
posted 02-03-06 11:41 AM EDT (US)     598 / 2994  
good point air.
posted 02-03-06 01:50 PM EDT (US)     599 / 2994  
Yes, Air, the reasons you listed are the reasons why I've changed the summons. Cosmos really only had one summons anyway, the Magic Servant, which was at best moderately useful. I think adding a life and death summons is a better us of the Penguin and Servant spells.

The increase in the casting cost of Mastery doesn't bother me a bit, and I wouldn't mind implementing this change. As Zyl writes, in a multiplayer game it is quite hard to cast it and requires substantial investment by the caster. I've seen it done a fair amount by players who are isolated on the map, though, which is one reason why we need to make more balanced pre created maps

Timelord is busy as beaver updating the ability list, and it looks very, very good. Many heroes will have one of the unique abilities, and there will be some interesting items lying around as well.

I'm still working on the readme files, and Joep is stil (I hope ) working with the city bit map images. If anyone else would like to try their hand in this area, I think he and I both would appreciate the help, as I believe he's only started the Fey Folk and not the Demons or Lizards.

Pushing forward,


posted 02-03-06 03:15 PM EDT (US)     600 / 2994  
I am all for deleting the Mastery Spells, btw! I usually agree to have them banned in my pbem games.

Sent another bunch of unused graphics!

Get the unofficial Patch v1.4. here!
My best AoW-Sm map: Drums of Death (This is the multiplayer version; for single player, or AI use different version)
Other proud AoW-sm maps: The Key of Kharzul, The Fight for Light, Waikiti Island, Goldrush Mountains
My proud AoW2 maps:The River Arne
Coordinator of the v1.4 and v1.5 patchteams, Seraph of AoWHeaven, PBEM Singles Champion 2008
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Age of Wonders 2 Heaven » Forums » General Discussion & Suggestions » Stranger's Dwigg Mod
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