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Age of Wonders 2 Heaven » Forums » General Discussion & Suggestions » Stranger's Dwigg Mod
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Topic Subject:Stranger's Dwigg Mod
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The_Stranger
Member
posted 03-30-05 02:59 AM EDT (US)         
Dwiggs5.0 is available here:

http://aow2.heavengames.com/downloads/showfile.php?fileid=612

Update 17-12-19 Joep and I are making an Age of Wonders 3 Dwiggs mod. If anyone is interested, just email me at bradjosse@gmail.com

Cheers!

In regards to Dwiggs mod, special thanks to:

El Joep-who did too much to list.

Timelord-again, too much to list.

Igoraki-converted many of the new graphics.

Merkraad-taught me the whole morphing thing

Kirky Picardo-maker of the excellent Brave New World mod. Like Timelord and Joep, he helped me too much to list just any one thing.

Kaskoid-Many of the excellent descriptions come from his desk.

Stillborn, Jean Luc, and many others also contributed some very creative descriptions. Look for the letter at the end of the description to see who wrote it.

If you wish to contact me, you can do so at bradjosse@gmail.com

[This message has been edited by The_Stranger (edited 12-16-2019 @ 08:19 PM).]

AuthorReplies:
Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-13-06 05:27 PM EDT (US)     871 / 2994       
bless giving death immunity is nice joke :P
Timelord
HG Cherub
posted 03-13-06 05:41 PM EDT (US)     872 / 2994       
DM, I thought so too about Corpus Furia.

But in the last Dwiggs game, I had my wizard, an injured Titan with about 9hp left, a hero, an avenger and a couple of other units. There must have been about 15-16 corpses on the field and Dracoden himself had a couple of knights near my Titan, a cavalry, a minotaur and one or two more units.
Then, he cast Corpus Furia - killed almost all his units and mine! Which was around 8-9 injured units. By the spell effects (in the side window), it certainly exploded more than 5 or 6 bodies and the damage dealt was around 8 or 9 per unit. Powerful, IMO.


2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
TruePurple
Member
posted 03-13-06 05:41 PM EDT (US)     873 / 2994       
Hows that air?
Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-13-06 06:04 PM EDT (US)     874 / 2994       
spell that making helpless opposite magic can be considered only as a joke, and if we consider other things in life vs death magic it looks like even more funny
TruePurple
Member
posted 03-13-06 08:02 PM EDT (US)     875 / 2994       
Like considering how death strike/dark gift opposes life magic?(with those life units with death weakness) Your "joke" argument doesn't hold alot of reason, since scorn doesn't constitute reason
Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-13-06 08:19 PM EDT (US)     876 / 2994       
truepurple try to play something at least
The_Stranger
Member
posted 03-13-06 11:38 PM EDT (US)     877 / 2994       
Let's confine ourselves to refutations using examples and such, not just dismissing each other's opinions Ok?

Good

I'm looking forward to a game this thursday, most of your wednesdays, if anyone will be on after 9pm gmt....that's 10am Down Under....

Cheers,

BJ

Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-14-06 02:11 AM EDT (US)     878 / 2994       
during this and next week i dont need to go to job so i m available for game almost anytime
Timelord
HG Cherub
posted 03-14-06 03:45 AM EDT (US)     879 / 2994       
Stranger, I will be online.

TP, I second Air's opinion that you atleast try Dwiggs before giving out ideas. Death Immunity negates many of the spells that the Death sphere has, not to mention it makes evil races even more weak against the Life sphere.
None of the buildable units I know in the Good races have death weakness (perhaps the Saint does?) while Undead and Shadowdemons have many units and heroes with Holy Weakness (even the Reaper has it!). So, why should Bless give death immunity when it is not required at all?


2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
The_Stranger
Member
posted 03-14-06 02:44 PM EDT (US)     880 / 2994       
My class is cancelled this morning...so, I'll be online today (your tuesday) from 9gmt as well

In general, I think flyers should not get more than one immunity, as they already cannot be attacked by the majority of units (without double gravity). So, let's assume that only 35% of units can attack a flyer. Throw a couple immunities on that and it will reduce that number by 2/6 or 1/3....

Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-14-06 05:45 PM EDT (US)     881 / 2994       
dark angel is special flier, if u didnt get double gravity when there are many of them u are hopeless anyway
TruePurple
Member
posted 03-14-06 06:24 PM EDT (US)     882 / 2994       
A third? Where are you getting this from stranger? I counted units that can attack fliers without medals down the list and I got about half that can, half that can't give or take.(slightly more that can then can't it seems) This includes shooters, entanglers, and other fliers. This does not include water ships or the racial 5 transport or settlers/repairers.

Of those perhaps an average of one or two unit per race that has a bolt or breath attack that would cause a flier with that immunity to be untouchable by that unit. And of course each is different, so an immunity thats not physical might protect a flier from a handful of racial units and pure magic of that type.

If blessed gave death immunity-
Necromancers & doom priests death bolts and plauge bringers, bone dragons and warlocks black breath would become harmless to those units. But black bolts and black breath are not the only things these units can do. Yes death strike couldn't curse and do 50% more damage. But I like the idea of bless preventing curse. Is evil only balanced by units being able to use death strike to do 50% more damage?

Of death spells effected by death immunity, theres death ray and I suppose death storm and evil woods. Thats it.

How about we take death immunity from several units,(especially archons) give death weakness to some units units. And give bless death immunity, if anything else, bless can be dispelled. Well except if angels get it at gold, but if you get a level 4 angel to gold, you deserve it.

We could also make bless and dark gift higher level spells then they are now, maybe level 2?

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-14-2006 @ 06:28 PM).]

Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-14-06 10:45 PM EDT (US)     883 / 2994       
Truepurple try to explain what the reason to make life sphere far above death
TruePurple
Member
posted 03-14-06 10:57 PM EDT (US)     884 / 2994       
You haven't demonstrated that with some adjustment to other things, holy immunity on one or two evil units. Maybe a little less death immunity on archons, one or two more death weak units... That bless with death immunity would "make life sphere far above death". Or even without those changes that it would do that.

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-14-2006 @ 10:59 PM).]

TruePurple
Member
posted 03-15-06 02:06 AM EDT (US)     885 / 2994       
Does life domain ability with a unit cause it to heal each turn its inside the domain of the player it belongs to? The description isn't quit clear.

Dwarven unit drill should have mountaineering.

In the latest game, I got alot of pure good archon heroes looking to be recruited at the dwarven town. Is there any way for you to make heroes appear of only the same type as the town? I wasnt sure about recruiting them because of moral problems, but wanted every hero I could get and was worried they would just go go somewhere else. Heroes could stand to be a little more expensive imo. But I love how some of these heroes are flavored, its nice to have heroes useful for more then domain straight off the bat.

Speaking of that game, you all quit? Even if we are testing a game, we should still finish it too if we can. We hadn't been playing that long.

Also, am I right in that shape changing does not change stats? (they dont show as changed, but maybe they do and just not show it?) It only replaces the abilities list of the hero/unit to that of a killed unit right? So the level of the unit killed by it doesn't necessarily matter, right? (like if its a low level with many nice abilities)

Dwarven clerics "holy champion" ability claims to add damage/att "vs good units"

Gnomes stone skin ability,
This reduces the value of using earth with dwarves (who are earthen themed) since you can't use stone skin on gnomes. Interesting story on them though, Possible they could remain 10 defense 8 resist and get stone skin on gold?

Doesn't stone skin make alot of sense on gargoyles?
For balance, you can add/subtract defense/resist accordingly. (since it can't be cast on gargoyles anyways, this would be decorative, well if you subtracted as much defense/resist as stone skin gave, but decorative matters a little too)

A thought on gyroscope, perhaps it could be more scout then defender? Subtracting some marksman and adding some vision? Dwarves don't really have any scouts (but gargoyles make a fine flier defender) or is that the idea as a way to balance them?

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-15-2006 @ 02:45 AM).]

Timelord
HG Cherub
posted 03-15-06 04:55 AM EDT (US)     886 / 2994       
TP, we decided to call it a day after you dropped again. It was between 4.30 a.m. and 6.30 a.m. for three of us!

Life Domain ability means the unit will heal every round as if it is inside the domain, irrespective of whether it is actually inside or not. This differs from the Life Domain spell which affects only units inside the domain.
If shapeshifting is the changeling abiliity, the stats get changes too, not only the abilities.

As far as I remember, Gargoyles were the lvl4 units of the Dwarves with all immunities and physical protection. A unit like that needs no more buffs, IMO.

Also, right now, life sphere is quite ok. I don't see a lot of problems with getting cursed...which is less common than so many evil units starting with holy weakness. I do not understand why we have to do all these changes to make bless give death immunity. Although there might be various avenues we can take to balance that, the question is why?


2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-15-06 05:53 AM EDT (US)     887 / 2994       
even with death weakness on all units bless giving death immunity will make life sphere far above death
TruePurple
Member
posted 03-15-06 06:24 AM EDT (US)     888 / 2994       

Quoted from tl:

If shapeshifting is the changeling abiliity, the stats get changes too, not only the abilities.


But hero shape shifting doesn't change stats right? Or it does, but it just doesnt show us?

Quoted from tl:

As far as I remember, Gargoyles were the lvl4 units of the Dwarves with all immunities and physical protection. A unit like that needs no more buffs, IMO.


Read more carefully, with stats adjusted down according to what stone skin gives, it would be purely decorative/flavor.

I wish you guys told me you were quiting, i waited around for some time wondering what was happening. Can we continue some other time? It was a very interesting game with nobody notable on top/surprisingly even with so many people playing.(from what I could tell of my own battles and of tactical battles I observed)

As far as blessed.. I'll get into it "tomorrow".

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-15-2006 @ 06:34 AM).]

DarkMystery
Member
posted 03-15-06 08:22 AM EDT (US)     889 / 2994       
TruePurple, master of odd suggestions!

Honored Core Balance Team Member of UPatch 1.4
Also known as TirAsleen
Dwiggsvillain
ElJoepo
Member
posted 03-15-06 09:36 AM EDT (US)     890 / 2994       
Speaking about odd suggestions, wouldn't it be nice if the nomad's caravan had 'throw spear' at silver (are war shrined cities -> caravans silver?), or normal level? I've seen countless cities taken, often defended by some lvl 1 scout, and attacked by some lvl 1 scout. A throw spear could just give that little edge. Also the good man is clearly carrying a spear in one hand, if I remember correctly.

Another odd suggestion would be to give 'enchanted roads' to wheeled machinery/units. This way they move faster on roads, which makes sense to me. A road should increase speed for things on wheels more than it does for horse/footmen.

I'm not a big fan of the stone skin on the gargoyle idea, while it is nicely thought of. I think it will create too much confusion for something that adds only a little flair to the game. Imagine players blaming eachother of having destructed a full earth sphere, enchanted hall with gargoyle's in them.

I'd like to create the new spell icon's, I learned a bit more about the ILB's and editing them and stuff. Maybe the sir can mail me which units should be 'spellified' exactly? I can't join tonight by the way, but if anyone's willing to play a game on thurstday I'm in. Hopefully a bit early, like starting between 8-10 PM.

[This message has been edited by ElJoepo (edited 03-15-2006 @ 09:37 AM).]

Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-15-06 09:54 AM EDT (US)     891 / 2994       
wht throw spear? maybe archery then ?
Timelord
HG Cherub
posted 03-15-06 10:15 AM EDT (US)     892 / 2994       
Caravans don't get silver medal even if it is a war-shrine city, I think.

I like the idea about Enchanted Roads and transports though. Makes sense, though I feel it would cripple the races that don't have a transport more, especially the slow Undead.


2009 1v1-Mapmaking Champion, Former PBEM Singles Champion, Proud contributor to the UPatch 1.4 and 1.5 effort
War of the Twins- 1 vs 1 PBEM map, Too Much Water - 1 vs 1 PBEM map, winner of 2009 1vs1 Mapmaking Challenge
My Dragon Age development blog
Air_warlord
Member
posted 03-15-06 12:01 PM EDT (US)     893 / 2994       
add traspot to them then bonamachine can be with 36 moves and transport 7 because its useless as combat machine
kaskoid
Member
posted 03-15-06 01:33 PM EDT (US)     894 / 2994       
To Hades (or Abbadon, or Hell, or Perdition; you choose) with the Undead! They are plenty powerful as is.

Nearly every description of undead/zombies/living dead, etc., in just about every novel or mythology credits them as being slow; shambling, shuffling, lurching about, and so on.

Every race should not be like every other race. That would be boring in the extreme. Might as well play Warlords...

When different races possess different skills and abilities, the necessity for mixed force armies becomes compelling, and makes Bard's Skills quite handy.

If you are Evil, would you limit yourself to recruiting only Orcs? or only Goblins? or only Dark Elves? or only anything? Booorrring!


Arch-Enemy of the Annoyingly Dense
Practitioner of Whimsy
Celt,Finn & Swede Elder Gamer
MitchK1989
Member
posted 03-15-06 02:01 PM EDT (US)     895 / 2994       
I find bonemachines to be plenty useful, maybe with a bit more def (or perhaps even more HP than they already have instead of more def)

The undead don't really need a transport, though the evil races could use a decent transport on at least one race (good has steam wagons, neutral has air galleys)... the question is, what would be a nice, unique, evil transport? I'm thinking a recolored force ship would do rather nicely for the demons, possibly a 32 movement floater with hurl firebomb and flame throwing to make it a bit slower than the other transport 7 units, but with more firepower to make up for it.

TruePurple
Member
posted 03-15-06 03:35 PM EDT (US)     896 / 2994       

Quoted from ElJoepo:

destructed a full earth sphere


Huh? That doesn't make any sense, you mean constructed? Even still that doesn't make sense.

Units with inherent enchantments, the enchantment is colored the dull yellow of normal abilities, spell enchantments are blue and usually close to the top of the list. (where ability enchantments get listed further down) Plus you can't cast stone skin on fliers. Anyone who knows anything at all about the game will have no confusion.

Quoted from timelord:

Life Domain ability means the unit will heal every round as if it is inside the domain, irrespective of whether it is actually inside or not.


The text describes it as healing as though life domain were cast,(5 health per turn) and speaks of domain, what your saying here doesn't compute. I mean if it were as your saying the text would simply say "unit heals 5hp per turn", especially since nonsummons heal whether in your domain or not.

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-15-2006 @ 04:11 PM).]

TruePurple
Member
posted 03-15-06 04:11 PM EDT (US)     897 / 2994       

Quoted from timelord:


I do not understand why we have to do all these changes to make bless give death immunity.


They aren't specifically to make bless give immunity, they are to balance the races.

As far as why have death immunity with bless, it goes back to balance, counterbalance. I like the idea of bless preventing curse, as a counter weight to dark gift. Of course bless should then become level 2, perhaps both these enchantments should become level 3?

Angels should be pure alighment, hopefully pure/high life will remain a respectable choice for none archons.

I like the idea of weight and counterweight. Weakness and immunity. It would be a good idea regardless of whether bless gets death immunity to have a evil unit with say holy protection, not specifically strong but some unique qualities, so its not built unless theres a specific need.

Maybe a unit called "the lost" a floating ghostly (undead of course) apparitions with pass wall and physical protection (but no death strike) and holy protection. It can disenchant. These poor souls used to be good people, but due to corruption and an untimely deaths, they violate principles they used to hold dear. Maybe this unit can be a town unit, or a neutral recruitment/quest one? Maybe just evil instead of pure evil even though its undead?

Maybe more unit/s with death weakness, and maybe an archon that loses death immunity?

You may say "well if bless gave death immunity, weakness doesn't matter!" It does matter, you can get ride of enchantments by the spell, either in combat or overhead, by unit and disenchant ability, or by steal enchantment. So death weakness does matter, just get ride of the bless enchantment at the right time, then clobber em with death.

P.S. As far as the game goes, you guys shouldn't have started if you didn't have time to finish, or at least told people you might not have time to finish.

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-16-2006 @ 05:26 AM).]

The_Stranger
Member
posted 03-15-06 06:10 PM EDT (US)     898 / 2994       
T. Purple,

we waited 10 minutes for you during an earlier drop...and we were quite tired at this time. It was a reasonable thing to do, I think

Joep, I really like your enchanted roads idea. I'll see if I can implement it. Also, throw spear to start wouldn't be bad for the Nomad guy. Spells ilbs needing to be changed are:

Hell hound to Salamnder
Fairy to Purger
Magic Servant to Syron
Dire Penguin to Red Dragon (we could easily just black drag)
Rift Lord to Pestilence
Rift Spawn to Nature Elemental

I'll respond to some other ideas later...

BJ

[This message has been edited by The_Stranger (edited 03-15-2006 @ 06:11 PM).]

TruePurple
Member
posted 03-15-06 07:11 PM EDT (US)     899 / 2994       
I really like the enchanted road idea too, except that it devalues the earth spell of the same name a little to have transports that can simply do so. We would need to decrease the spells cost etc or something if we added it to a number of transport units.

BTW, might path of life & heal be too much for the halfings garden cart? Might gardners get path of life earlier then gold? (and cost a little more to compensate) Not that Ive tried halfings in theta yet.

P.S. 10 minutes? I didn't think it was that long, my computer had BSoD (blue screen of death/crashed) and I had to wait for everything to reload and for it to scan for any bugged folders created by the sudden shut down. Still, if it was that late when we first started for people, someone should have mentioned this and the possibility of not everyone being able to finish the game that night.

[This message has been edited by TruePurple (edited 03-15-2006 @ 07:18 PM).]

DarkMystery
Member
posted 03-15-06 11:28 PM EDT (US)     900 / 2994       

Quoted from Air:

add traspot to them then bonamachine can be with 36 moves and transport 7 because its useless as combat machine

i agree, they desperatly need it, but i mentioned that one like a hundred times.

i disagree with kaskoid about undead beeing slow, thats only about the minor undead, the zombies, walking dead etc. its plain nonsense to suggest a vampire or spectre beeing slow, they are usually fast as light in mythologies, can often teleport and phase around at will.

and i think undead can be way more powerful, cause of many reasions, like their weaknesses(Holy), low res, def, slowness and extreme alignment.


Honored Core Balance Team Member of UPatch 1.4
Also known as TirAsleen
Dwiggsvillain
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