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AoW2/SM Scenario Design
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Topic Subject: Bug/Problem in a scenario: Locations are explored in game and have monsters standing on them..
posted 09-02-17 03:12 PM EDT (US)   
Hello,

subject says it all:

I have a downloaded scenario (single XL, 'Overwhelming Evil'). Not only is the map very beautiful, it is also a scenario in my taste. I already spent hours playing this :-)

It also is an very old scenario, but was done for AoWSM and UPatch 1.4. I use both.

It works nicely, and I did change it a bit. But from the beginning - and also with the original downloaded scenario from here - there is a curious bug:

Several locations (of type Dungeon, Cemetery, Shipwreck, Camp) are set in the map originally as active, with a certain monster strength (Average mostly). But when I start the scenario in the game, several of these locations - curiously all on the lower part of the map, are shown in status 'Explored', but have monster groups standing on them. The monster groups are obviously the groups you should meet in these locations. You can kill the monsters (they are in Guard mode, and stay where they are), but the location gives nothing since it is in state 'explored'.

If I delete these locations in the editor, some other locations may or may not develop the error. Deleting one location, saving, and setting it new does not help. The map verifies ok, and can be played. Actually it is a small problem, but it grates...

Did anybody run in this problem or even have a work around for it?

I am using AOWSM 1.4 UPatch.

(To look at this problem simply find the scenario 'Overwhelming Evil' from Bubbaspud, download the map, load it and disable Fog and Explore. You can see the locations in the lower part of this map, around 10-15 rows of lowest hexes. In upper parts of this huge maps all is well).

Thank you!
M.
Replies:
posted 09-12-17 04:50 PM EDT (US)     1 / 3  
Answering my own question, just for reference:

The map (Overwhelming Evil) is made with BNW. The author (bubbaspud) states it as UPatch 1.4, but is named OverwhelmigEvilbnw.ahm (sik).

So is the other map from this author, Aliens Attack. It also was at some point made with BNW active.

The Aliens Attack map does not open in the game (UPatch1.4, no BNW) at all. After clicking the START-button, the game hangs. There are errors in the log.

The problem with both maps is BNW. If you do not have it (I have a clean UPatch1.4) then there are problems and error messages in the log. The game does not report this, it simply has fatal errors (access violations).

To correct this, you need to open the map in the editor, and scanning over it, checking all placed unit stacks. Stacks with BNW units will be faulty, or even missing! If you manage to correct these stacks, the map is playable again. I commented about this problem in the DL area with the Alien Attacks map.

My problem in my post above must have the same or a similar reason. I will try to correct it the way I described above.

The problem is, if you are using MODs (like BNW) and use the new objects or units in a map, the map stops being playable for UPatch1.4. It may be playable, but there will be issues and problems.

EDIT 09/14/17:

Found by accident the real problem (defenders standing on structure, structure is shown as explored):

There is a small player made docu in the download area named 'Operations of Item Properties'. The author explains, what he found out by experimenting. An interesting document, by the way.

Among other things he explains what happens, if you have a big map with many locations, which 'generate' items, i.e. camp sites, sunken ships, and so on. If you have not enough items configured and free (i.e. not used elsewhere in the map) the game will mark sites for which it cannot find free items as 'Explored', and the defenders will be visible and standing on it in 'Guard' mode!

And this is exactly what happened to me and baffled me to no end. It was quite simple to test the fix, I made several items in the two 'Average' categories, and all the sites worked now normally.

Also - from the small docu mentioned above - if you have not enough items in the Low and Average category, the game will use items from the 'Exceptional' category. This can lead to a very valuable and strong item found in a measly camp site with low defenses. A pity that Triumph never documented this...

So always have enough items in all item categories, then the system will work better.

This will be my last post for now, as obviously nobody seems interested enough to just write a short answer or something. Obviously map making for this game is dying...

M.

[This message has been edited by Marilith77 (edited 09-14-2017 @ 09:36 AM).]

posted 09-16-17 06:30 PM EDT (US)     2 / 3  
Hello
i would like to help but I have no real idea what to do and how to help.
I was an expert in mapmaking in the days far beyond.
It is nice to see there are still some people left playing AoWSM and all the nice mods.
If you like we could discuss about AoWSM but I think I can not help with the problem you have in BNW.

AoWSM Maps: 1. Marlenes Welt 2. Marlenes Schatten 3. Marlenes Gnade
Up.1.4 Maps: 4. Secrets of Marlenia (UPatch 1.4 Map - update) 5. Gates of Elocin - Part I (Mapmaking Competition - Winning Map) 6. Davidīs Winter Wonderland 7. Fairy Wedding
8. Marleneīs_Laughter 9. The Gods Arena Of Magic And Power 10. The_Wilderness 11. Kayland (AoW I Mod) 12. Mia-Mina_&_The_Seadrake
11. AoW I Sound Set for AoWSM 12. Gentleman Rules Set
Need Help? The Conqueror's Fieldguide to The Groll's Universe
Proud member of the Upatch 1.4, 1.5 & 1.6 Team
posted 09-18-17 04:35 AM EDT (US)     3 / 3  
Hello The Groll,

and thank you for answering. In my second post I also mentioned the solution for the BNW problem (is a bit of work, you have to check the entire map for disappeared or buggy units), and for the problem with the guards for item spawning locations (camps, dungeon, cementary, etc.) standing on it instead of being invisible.

tl;dr:

BNW-map used without BNW: Open in editor and check the entire map, the editor should replace non existing units, but does not always.

Units standing on camps, etc. camps are shown as explored:
There are not enough items defined in the map and free (usable) for the game to fill these sites, hence the guards standing on it and the the status set to 'explored'.

I just posted this here, because I could find it nowhere. The forums here have a lot of usable content, but I could not find hints for the second problem. I hope somebody will find it useful...

M.
Age of Wonders 2 Heaven » Forums » AoW2/SM Scenario Design » Bug/Problem in a scenario: Locations are explored in game and have monsters standing on them..
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