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AoW2 Gameplay Help & Strategies
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Topic Subject: AoW2 = MoM2 ?
posted 01-20-02 07:43 PM EDT (US)   
AoW was basically a (damn good) mix of "Heroes of Might and Magic" from 3DO, and "Master of Magic" from Microprose.

Now AoW 2 is upcoming, and looking at the feature list it's as if Master of Magic has risen anew.

Just about all the features of MoM that was missing in the first AoW will be in AoW 2.

So, AoW 2 is unofficially MoM 2 at the same time...

Anyways, just some thoughts. Those that can remember both HoMM and MoM should give this some thought...

--|--
Tino Didriksen
http://ProjectJJ.dk/

Replies:
posted 01-21-02 09:45 PM EDT (US)     1 / 21  
MoM is dead, long live AoW. I played MoM, I liked MoM but you just have to get over it. AoW is better than MoM ever was.

MoM was never even really finished as there were serious bugs even in the last patch. The ai was terrible and the only way it was a challenge was if I limited myself to one city.

In MoM you had to build cities, that won't be the case in AoW2. Its just not MoM2, give it up.

posted 01-22-02 05:46 AM EDT (US)     2 / 21  
Well, first love is always something special, isnt it?

But I totally agree with Frogman. AoW IS better and the real challenge isnt gaming against the AI but other human players.
So the AI is important to become fond of the game, but in the end, its also the diversity and variety of strategic, tactical choices you get. Its take a loong time until you learn and develop all those strategies that work

posted 01-22-02 07:06 AM EDT (US)     3 / 21  
But the subject wasn't about if MoM is better then AoW or not, but I and everyone should agree it's not!

Many features from MoM will appear in AoW2. See my excellent post about this. AoW 2 = beautified Master of Magic?

Quoted from Frogman:

In MoM you had to build cities, that won't be the case in AoW2.


You can build cities in AoW2 but that's not very common from what I have read.

Quoted from Jezral:

So, AoW 2 is unofficially MoM 2 at the same time...


I can almost agree to that. IF MoM 2 would be like MoM 1 with only better graphic, more detail and better AI. Of course that's hypothetical. Also I don't know exactly what features that will be included in AoW2.

It's not really important if AoW2 will look like MoM or not, it's just fun discussing it, mainly because it was a great game and still is! Well perhaps not if you looking for a challenge when playing against the AI.

posted 01-22-02 11:49 AM EDT (US)     4 / 21  
AoW2 = An interesting game that the developers wanted to create after doing AoW. It so happens that we received TONS of feedback. The highest requested items we took very very seriously, and it just so happens that the fans of MOM were very vocal about their want to see things like random maps, build your own cities, and a number of other features that were only had in MoM. However, I think once you see the game, you will see that this is something very special, done by a group of developers that care about a game, not recreating nostalgia in those who once played a game and want to recapture their youth by playing something like that again...

Well, it would be nice if AoW2 were a fountain of youth... but um... yeah... --Ray

posted 01-22-02 01:26 PM EDT (US)     5 / 21  

Quote:

The highest requested items we took very very seriously, and it just so happens that the fans of MOM were very vocal about their want to see things like random maps, build your own cities, and a number of other features that were only had in MoM.

Kudos to RayB, Lennart and all the rest who frequent these boards and take the gamer's feedback seriously.

Yes MoM was a classic, yes AoW is a classic in it's own right. Yes AoW2 will be a classic also, with many original features and many features influenced from many past games.

Thanks again guys for all your hard work. I can't wait to sit on the Wizard's Throne.

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss

[This message has been edited by Chaos Spawn (edited 01-22-2002 @ 01:27 PM).]

posted 01-22-02 02:28 PM EDT (US)     6 / 21  
Having just seen MoM being played for the first time, I'd have to say that the original AoW is the son of MoM. It uses a lot of the same graphic themes. In addition, I noticed that the settler in MoM looks a great deal like the pioneer in AoW2. The one thing that stood out in MoM (which is not present in AoW) is the more Civ-like handling of resources and city building. The big difference seems to be the speed at which the game progresses.
posted 01-22-02 02:28 PM EDT (US)     7 / 21  
I played Master of Magic by Microprose for a long time and have also played Age of Wonders. I am still waiting for Master of Magic X to make an appearance by a big developer. The only reason i play Age of Wonders is because it closely resembles MoM, but does not quite have the same large scope. The best thing that the owners of AofW should do is acquire the rights to MoM and create a whole new updated tech eng and all the latest/greatest bells, whistles, and manual with the editing eng of course. All of these other games, and i have played the antecedents or current progenitors for all the games that were mentioned as the current MoM crownholder. None can even hope hold the Wizards slippers as a competitor! When will this hopeless state of affairs in pc gaming be righted? Please strong Publisher Prince save the day! Release MoM2 and watch ur demon competition for my $ and be skewered by your exhalted stock earnings!
posted 01-22-02 09:37 PM EDT (US)     8 / 21  

I've said this before and I'll say it again...

Master of Magic was a classic! I salute the developers at Triumph Studios for listening to our ideas. So what if AoW and AoW II were inspired by MoM. The development of MoM was inspired by the first Civ. Notice something here... they were all great games well worth every dollar gamers spent on them. I'm sure AoW II will be just as great and that we will "see that this is something very special."

As for the bugs in MoM... that was typical of Microprose. Look at all the serious bugs that MOO II had. Damn, does anyone remember the 2nd patch for MOO II. The one that basically took one hour rewriting most of the program. I had a laugh that day... it was like I had a programmer take over my computer. LOL Anyway, despite some gems, the reputation for rushed buggy games was finally starting to catch up to that company. I think they were damn lucky that Hasbro Interactive took them over when they did.


Best Regards To ALL!


Raven Bear
New Brunswick, Canada
posted 01-29-02 09:09 PM EDT (US)     9 / 21  
IMHO, even if hampered by an easy-to-beat AI, MoM remains a masterpiece in videogames history: a very well planned mix of turn based strategy, rpg and civ development.

No other game managed to combine the complexity of "Civilization", the epics and roleplay elements of "Warlords II", the tactical combat of "Centurion: Defender of Rome" and the magical system of "Magic: the Gathering" in a totally addictive fashion...
MoM has been this and more than this.

AoW is different, but no less addictive. Personally, I am grateful to developers for what they did with AoW and can't wait to have AoW2 in my hands...
Personally, I think there's no point in saying "Dont develop AoW2: develop MoM2."

AoW has many great features, among which there's a superb plot and a great background (well characterized races and all), plus a high replayability due to the different choices you can do along the way to the Valley of Wonders and thanks to the included editor.
Not to mention multiplayer mode, which (sadly enough) MoM lacked. Finally, AoW is far more bug-free than MoM.

Nonetheless, I agree on the fact that some things in AoW were less-than-perfect compared with the likes in MoM:
1) some spells included in MoM (and not in AoW) were absolutely brilliant, Create Artifact above all - man, I did create some extremely powerful items with that spell... I enjoyed it very much. All in all, MoM spells seemed to be more and more diversified...
2) magic spheres in AoW are not much diversified: all have more or less the same spells (I mean: spells are different but often have same effect on gameplay): think about the storms (lighting storm, fire storm, nature storm etc.): all spheres have the same spell, only thing changing is damage source!
3) same thing for units: races had more different gameplay in MoM than in AoW
4) casting spells overland is WAY less effective in AoW than in MoM - and, personally, I do like casting spells from my tower...
5) city managment was more complex - and entertaining, IMHO - in MoM: I like Civ-like city development

Fortunately, Triumph Studios proved to listen carefully to users suggestions, and many abovementioned problems seem to have been addressed in AoW2... Which is to say: "Why trying to develop a MoM2, when you can just develop something better?"

So, I can't wait to see if AoW2 is going to prove itself better than what MoM2 could have been, and, given the premises, I am quite confident it will.
Kudos to Triumph Studios for developing AoW and AoW2: continue this way!!!


"This is NOT happening."

- Lucas of Hilm

[This message has been edited by Lucas of Hilm (edited 01-29-2002 @ 09:16 PM).]

posted 01-30-02 02:47 AM EDT (US)     10 / 21  
Number 4 was also the most cumbersome part of MOM, no micro managment hell thank you .

Otherwise MOM was very good.

BM

posted 01-30-02 11:15 AM EDT (US)     11 / 21  

Quote:

Number 4 was also the most cumbersome part of MOM, no micro managment hell thank you

City Management could be put on 'Autopilot' by selecting the Grand Visier option from the pulldown menu.

Quote:

MoM is dead, long live AoW. I played MoM, I liked MoM but you just have to get over it.

I don't know if it is fair to say MoM is dead:

Master of Magic II Release Date

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss
posted 01-30-02 11:23 AM EDT (US)     12 / 21  
MoM2 release date?
Hmmm... Sounds like vaporware to me...

Quoted from Master of Magic Resource Centre:

Infogrames owns the MoM rights, and some of us here at QS are really hoping to get a crack at developing MoM2, but there's nothing official to be said at this point. My personal opinion is that if Civ3 and MoO3 do well, there's a fair chance of seeing a MoM2, but "if/maybe" is still all it is right now and the opinion's worth what you've paid for it.


Frankly, i think that if MoM2 was in development, we would have known...

"This is NOT happening."

- Lucas of Hilm

[This message has been edited by Lucas of Hilm (edited 01-30-2002 @ 11:24 AM).]

posted 01-30-02 11:31 AM EDT (US)     13 / 21  

Quote:

Frankly, i think that if MoM2 was in development, we would have known...

Frankly, I'd think you'd be paying closer attention to the post dates of your news.

The link I posted above was just updated onto the Ugly Little Master of Magic Site (Master of Magic Resource Center) on the 28th - 2 days ago.

Your quote appeared on the Gossip and Tidbits page of the same site and was sourced and dated as follows:

Quote:

-- from comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic 07.12.01

I will not be mocked.

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss
posted 01-30-02 03:13 PM EDT (US)     14 / 21  
LOL it's funny you feel mocked, while noone is mocking you (at least, I wasn't).
Still, if you like precision, you should have quoted the whole title:

Quoted from MoM Resource Centre - Homepage:

01.28.02 MoMII release date ?


Notice the question mark at the end.

Why there's a question mark?

Because the release date is pure speculation, as stated by the page indicating it:

Quoted from CG Online - Release Dates page:

Release dates are always tentative-even the game publishers don't usually know exactly when a game is coming out until they ship it to manufacturing. We report the most accurate information we have, but often we have to approximate

If I had a cent for every time a VG site or magazine announced the release date of a game which wasn't even in development...
IMHO, until otherwise noted - possibly by someone really working on it or knowing something for sure - MoMII release is still subject to what my precedent quote from Gossip and Tidbits page says: noone can tell if and when it will be released...

C'mon Chaos, don't be unnecessarily harsh. Noone was willing to offend you: a forum is a place where ppl help themselves, not a place to show how nasty you are when someone contraddicts you...

Anyway, let's get back IT: after all, this isn't a MoM forum, right?


"This is NOT happening."

- Lucas of Hilm

[This message has been edited by Lucas of Hilm (edited 01-30-2002 @ 03:33 PM).]

posted 01-30-02 05:28 PM EDT (US)     15 / 21  
CGONLINE said it was a mistake so I guess we can forget that for now . Who cares? AOW2 is soon out.

BM

posted 01-30-02 05:33 PM EDT (US)     16 / 21  
Interesting to read all of this. Myself personally, I remember hearing claims way back before AoW was even out that it was going to be a modern version of MoM. This turned out to be very inaccurate. It was more of a Heros of Might and Magic clone. So while I will have to wait and see what AoW2 will be like, I'm very doubtful it will be any more modern MoM than AoW was. AoW2 might be a really great game, but it's still going to leave me and others still wanting a a true modern MoM.

I've come to the conclusion, though, that big commercial developers out there are never going to make a MoM2 or anything similar. So I've decided that any hope for a MoM2 type of game is going to have to come from the fans. Thus I've been coming up with ideas myself for a MoM2 game. Heck, look what happened with FreeCiv (http://www.freeciv.org). Why couldn't we do the same with a MoM2?

So for everyone out there still wishing for a MoM2, there may yet still be hope.

[This message has been edited by Tclord (edited 01-30-2002 @ 05:34 PM).]

posted 01-31-02 02:31 AM EDT (US)     17 / 21  

Quote:

C'mon Chaos, don't be unnecessarily harsh. Noone was willing to offend you: a forum is a place where ppl help themselves, not a place to show how nasty you are when someone contraddicts you...

Harsh?

Nasty?

Hrmmm...I didn't even raise my voice...

*shrugs*

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss
posted 02-02-02 01:54 PM EDT (US)     18 / 21  

Quote:

CGONLINE said it was a mistake

Where'd you get that from Barman?

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss
posted 02-02-02 07:10 PM EDT (US)     19 / 21  
From cgonline . (forums)

BM

posted 02-03-02 12:16 PM EDT (US)     20 / 21  
Thanks Barman.

I knew deep in my heart that the release date was too good to be true.

-Chaos


This body... this body holding me... be my reminder here that I am not alone in...This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal all this pain is an illusion. - From Tool’s
Parabola - Maynard James Keenan
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me... for me...FOR MEEEEEE!! - From Queen’s Bohemian Rhapsody - Freddie Mercury
Insanity is but the price paid by mankind for his intellect. -Chaos Spawn Zone 666 The Abyss

[This message has been edited by Chaos Spawn (edited 02-03-2002 @ 12:25 PM).]

posted 02-05-02 09:49 AM EDT (US)     21 / 21  
Here's something I posted about MOM2 on usenet a while back:

-----

A friend steered me over to this little shred of hope. It seems that Quicksilver (designer/developer of MOO3) would be willing to do a MOM2 if:

a) MOO3 is a hit (as defined by Infogrames...whatever that may be)
b) Infogrames believes MOM2 can be a hit as well
c) they get paid to make it

Here's the snippet from the official FAQ:

"Will there be a sequel to the Master of Magic series?

Not exactly. One does not necessarly FOLLOW the other. However, success with MOO3 makes is MORE LIKELY for their to me a Master of Magic II ( because if MOO3 is a hit, it will demonstrate that the strategy game genre should continue to besupported ), and more likelky to be done by Quicksilver ( because if MOO3 is a hit, Infogrames will know we can "deliver the goods" and should be worthy of developing MOM2 )."

Linkage:

Official MOO3 FAQ: http://www.orionsector.com/faqgeneral.shtml

Official MOO3 site: http://moo3.quicksilver.com/main.html

But with AoW2, I'm not at all concerned about MOM2.


GuildBoss - Guild and Clan Management Utility
www.guildboss.com
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