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Topic Subject: Wind Walking
posted 07-28-01 10:13 AM EDT (US)   
I had this nice stack of heros and nature elementals all with wind walking. When I cast air mastery they got unbeatable! Double movement and all allowed straight into cities. And half the movement for any other flying units. Good fun to see dragons struggling along! Also affected tactical combat as well, so it was all going very well.

Then I went underground and at some point (possibly the first underground city I attacked, but I can't be sure) it became impossible to fly into cities. The units were still showing as wind walkers, and air mastery still gave them double movement.

First of all I thought the enemy had cast some "anti" spell, but I couldn't see any proof of this. Any explanations?

Replies:
posted 07-28-01 03:06 PM EDT (US)     1 / 14  
Yes, that's easily explained!

One of the first patches changed wind walking from giving flight to only giving floating. Real flying was way too powerful! And of course you can't float over city walls.

I'm surprised that Air Mastery still increases movement for the Wind Walking units! Does it work on units with inherent floating as well?

posted 07-30-01 04:37 AM EDT (US)     2 / 14  
I've heard about wind walking changing to floating with the patch and I've got 1.36 installed, but I'm pretty sure my NE's were walsing about all over the place (i.e. into cities) UNTIL I went downstairs. I'll have to call up the old saved game and check this out.

But definitely, air mastery gave them some added movement. I'll check again, but I think it was double and it defintely halved the movement of dragons. It was good!!

Edit: I'm not sure about inherent floaters - I don't think I had any. I'll check this out too.

[This message has been edited by unicorn77 (edited 07-30-2001 @ 04:38 AM).]

posted 07-31-01 03:26 AM EDT (US)     3 / 14  
After checking:

Wind walking lets the unit it is cast on fly over walls, on my 1.36 system, but only above ground, it seems.

Air mastery doubles your flyers movement and halves all other flyers movement. It also makes earth spells cost double. So a 32 movement point flyer which normally moves 8 hexes can move 16, whereas opponents can only move 4.

Air mastery doesn't affect floaters.

posted 07-31-01 04:59 AM EDT (US)     4 / 14  
I was completely sure you were wrong about Wind Walking units beeing able to fly over walls, but I made a test anyway. I mean, I knew that after the patches it only gives floating. To my surprise it works! You can Wind Walk over walls!

I tested it on all three map levels, and it works everywhere. So, Wind Walking suddenly became much more useful than I thought it was! Floating with wall climbing (or if you like: flying without the possibility to strike at other flyers) is much more worth than just plain floating!

I also tried to cast it on a floating unit (Beholder), but that was not possible. It's not a valid target.

It works the same both in Triumph 1.36 rules and in Warlock's Rule-Set.

posted 07-31-01 06:41 AM EDT (US)     5 / 14  
So, back to my original point, why have I got a saved game where my windwalkers can't fly over (some) walls?

Nojd, I can send you the file if you want.

posted 07-31-01 07:20 AM EDT (US)     6 / 14  
Sure, send me the file! I'm sure I can't offer any explanations, but it's still interesting...

Try this address:
nojd@heavengames.com

posted 07-31-01 01:43 PM EDT (US)     7 / 14  
Just sent it!
posted 07-31-01 02:20 PM EDT (US)     8 / 14  
Got it, tried it, and saw that you were right!

In my tests I had used empty cities, with walls. Your cities were defended.

A little more testing revealed that Wind Walking gives you the right to attack a walled city on any map level. But only on the surface is it possible to fly over walls.

So to sum it up, Wind Walking gives:
1. Floating
2. Wall Climbing on the surface map lavel
3. The right to attack walled cities (and towers I guess) in the Caverns and Depths, but not climb the walls. If the city is undefended, it's yours! But if it is defended, you're still allowed to attack, and possibly shoot down the defenders in the city from outside the wall and thus be able to take the city.

posted 07-31-01 06:59 PM EDT (US)     9 / 14  
I did a little more testing, and found:

The tower walls are no different from the city walls, and there is no difference between wooden and stone walls.

Air Mastery doubles the movement of the own Wind Walking units. Wind Walkers for other races are not affected in either way.

posted 07-31-01 10:49 PM EDT (US)     10 / 14  
Hmmm, I'm still skeptical as I was sure this was long decided.

Nojd, did you try moving a unit with Wind Walking over a wall in TC or FC? Perhaps there's difference?

posted 08-01-01 02:34 AM EDT (US)     11 / 14  
Glad to have provoked some debate!

Everything Nojd says looks right from the game experience I had.

I thought about seeing what FC did - but then you can't actually force your units to go over the wall.

posted 08-01-01 04:03 AM EDT (US)     12 / 14  
Wind Walking into empty, walled in cities never results in a battle, so there is never a FC or a TC. You just capture the place without a fight.

For the defended locations, I chose TC in the previous tests. If I hit the auto button in the TC, everyone started to retreat. If I play the TC, it works as described in the previous post.

I tested FC just now, and the Wind Walkers are not in any way hindered by any walls on any map level. So for FC, Wind Walking gives Wall Climbing on all map levels.

posted 08-01-01 02:13 PM EDT (US)     13 / 14  
Yes, I see! On my saved game I just sent 3 gold level and 2 silver level windwalking NE's against 19 Goblin units mainly in a city (including level 12, 27 and 30 heros) and they slaughtered the lot for the loss of one of the silvers. The other one, of course, became gold!

Unfortunately, I find they can't attack other flying units, otherwise I'd be claiming them as the most unbalanced unit!

posted 09-04-04 12:11 PM EDT (US)     14 / 14  
*digs up this old thread*

Edit: had < & > instead of *.

I was up to play an old save game i havent played for long, i misclicked and accidentally opened another old one, since i didnt have much to do, i continued to play. After awhile, i cast air mastery(Silly having 4 air with dwarves eh?), got a few air elementals, everything was normal... until, i moved my leader, as usual, it was enchanted with wind walking, having 37 mp i moved so fast i could not believe it! after that, i cast haste on my leader, i moved to the other end of the map within just a few small turns, this way, i was able to control about everything, HAIL AIR MASTERY!


I have gone to find myself.
If i get back before i return, keep me here.

[This message has been edited by Silver_Dragon (edited 09-04-2004 @ 12:13 PM).]

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